A few philosophical thesis other than determinism come up during their debate. Michael uses Doug Forcett as proof that something must be very wrong since Doug should obviously have more than enough points to get into the good place. Schur also worked on "The Office" as a writer, producer, and actor. In the beginning, before frozen yogurt shops permeated The Good Place and . A pilgrimage to Canada to meet the legendary Doug Forcettthe guy who correctly guessed what the afterlife isturns out to be a cautionary tale on the drawbacks of ultra-utilitarianism, Fork yeah: The Good Place is back. "And I did, in fact, throw up when I got home. Michael can design, but he can't seem to create, he needs Janet to actually produce his vision and run it since he just seems to be the idea man, and as they work together they start creating a natural bond with each other, Michael from learning what it's like to be human, Janet through her long series of reboots and reincarnations. Please also read our Privacy Notice and Terms of Use, which became effective December 20, 2019. The weekly winnerwell, loser is probably more accuratewill be judged by their ethical choices rather than any subjective measures. But, Ill say a word about E5-6 after that, as they imply interesting issue about humanitys natural goodness.Episode Seven spins off of Episode Six, in which Eleanor reconnects with her mother. Follow this blogger. Doug Forcett, a character in Netflixs The Good Place, Points assigned for a gift of flowers in the 1500s. The rich man goes to Hell (or purgatory?) I think it's basically perfect, except for Doug Forcett. But, then, Michael says that, In one of the reboots, you and Chidi fell in lovedeeply, and you told him that you loved him, and he told you that he loved you back. Episode Seven opens with Michael and Eleanor having wandered into a public library, because they need somewhere quiet for the Earthly Eleanor to experience memories of her afterlife (and, as Michael says, theres no place more deserted than a public library in Arizona.) Eleanor views her afterlife memories. What's wrong with my argument? Omniscient Australian Librarian. Why must a product of symmetric random variables be symmetric? Other things in the void included a literal dumpster fire, and of course the computer perched at a standing desk. Chidi has some qualms and questions about such a morally ambiguous undertaking, including: Is there a moral imperative to help you? Hes referring to Immanuel Kants categorical imperative, or the idea that we must all act according to an unwavering moral code that has nothing to do with situational variables. All rights reserved. On one hand, Eleanor doesnt belong in The Good Place, and helping her might be considered a violation of the categorical imperative if its considered a form of cheating. 2023 Minute Media - All Rights Reserved. Most Disappointing Yahoo Answers Search Result: Not only has no one already answered Eleanors question, but no one can ask it, because its 67 characters too long. When Eleanor, Chidi, Tahani, and Jason go back to Earth and are told about the afterlife by Michael, any good actions they do are immediately invalid because their motivation is now corrupt. And Schur needed a model. Sponsored content He seemed to be truly concerned about the snails on his garden, not just acting to "cheat the game". THEORY: Doug Forcett was 100% Correct This got long on another post so I thought I'd put it here: Essentially, Doug Forcett wasn't 92% correct, instead he was 100% correct it wasn't what the angels and demons wanted to hear so they couldn't understand it or outright rejected it. Having real-life spouses make cameo appearances is a long-running Mike Schur tradition. Wanting to avoid The Bad Place usually not bad. ", Shepard plays a sleazy demon attending a party in the Bad Place, and tells Bell's character, Eleanor, "You got that good stank.". Noah Garfinkel is a writer and producer, known for Single Parents (2018), Abby's (2019) and New Girl (2011). It also involves him doing whatever the local teen sociopath (or anyone) tells him to do. "If I remember correctly, [Good Place writer-producer] Joe Mande just texted me and said, 'We need to take a picture of someone who looks like a '70s stoner. "It was one of the first details of the show that I came up with," series creator Mike Schur remembers. Eleanor helpfully finds a philosophy book on the shelves and reads the definition of determinism, as the theory that we have no control over our own actions. I hoped this day would never arrive, but Yahoo Answers has finally failed to quench our curiosity, for the first and only time. There's nothing wrong with this. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Their intent and mindset where not taken in to consideration. Lets swing into Thursday nights episode, Dont Let the Good Life Pass You By.. If you contribute to the greater good while still remaining happy and comfortable, he explains, then other people will recognize that charity and service can enrich their own lives, too. I love spending time outdoors, and feel deeply our responsibility to this incredible planet that we call home. How Marvel went big with Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. But the biggest question about Harden remainsand it wont be answered until the playoffs. Eleanor helpfully finds a philosophy book on the shelves and reads the definition of determinism, as "the theory that we have no . Mande's recurring character Todd shows up on the first season, and then again on season two when Eleanor and Chidi overhear a group of demons talking about Michael's failed experiment. (Garfinkel concurs: "My hair naturally balloons into a '70s stoner haircut. How are the humans helping each other the explanation for Doug being 100% correct? He has become what Janet calls a happiness pump; in other words, hes trying to pump as much happiness into the world as possible at his own expense. The Good Face: The origin story of The Good Place 's Doug Forcett portrait. The peasant got positive points because he did a good thing by making his mom happy. Fast-forward a few years or however many Bearimys, and a bigger full-circle moment arrived when Garfinkel made a cameo in the series finale. Thanks for the question. This might even be directly stated in the show. "A lot of it is his hair, right? Doug once said that the last time he went to donate blood, they ended up giving him more because he had already donated too much. So, if you cant count on moral desert, why even try to be a good person? For most of us, this seems logical: We grow into ourselves as individuals by learning and changing based on past experiences. The modern day man got positive points for the same thing, but then received many more negative points because the money he bought the flowers with went to a large corporation which pollutes the planet. Eleanor, at least, seems to be assuming incompatibilism. says Garfinkel. Fandom Muthead Futhead Fanatical What is Fandom? By Kants rationale, lying, stealing, and other immoral behaviors can never be justifiedeven if youre lying to spare someones feelings or stealing a loaf of bread to feed a starving child. And more than 92 percent perfect. Or, is moral training in childhood required to get moral adults? What matters is the difference between "certainty" vs "belief." Some incompatibilistscalled hard deterministshold that determinism is true, and so we lack free will. How to increase the number of CPUs in my computer? That needs to change. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Doug merely has belief: he thinks he's figured it out, but without explicit confirmation that he's right, he still has to make a choice whether to act in accordance with his possibly-true/possibly-false hypothesis. Doug goes to Heaven, but the rich man went to Hell [or purgatory?]. As a number of you theorized last week, we indeed went to Canada to meet Doug Forcett, the lionized Canadian who got closest to figuring out how the afterlife works: And so, who did they get to play Doug Forcett? Even if that warmth comes with a comment about a best friends grating speaking voice.. The "big four" are: transportation (car, plane), diet (esp beef, food waste), home energy (esp heating), and general consumption. Elinor & co have certainty that the points-system is real, because Michael gave them positive confirmation. While Good Janet is modeled after retro air hostesses, Mann used Sandy's (Olivia Newton-John) slinky, all-black outfit from the "Grease" musical number "You're the One That I Want" as inspiration for Bad Janet. Planned Maintenance scheduled March 2nd, 2023 at 01:00 AM UTC (March 1st, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup. Cookie Notice Then, on season three, a slug-like creature from another dimension drapes itself around Tahani's neck when they enter the Interdimensional Hole of Pancakes to meet the judge. Eleanor has become enamored of this view and Michaela divine, eternal beingattempts to argue her out of it. Doug Forcett Is Worshipped . Doug Forcett / Played by Michael McKeanThe Good Place Just so, who is the picture of Doug Forcett? Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. "It was just a little, little Easter egg. The Good Place neighborhood number is tied to the Fibonacci sequence, and was shown on the horoscope Eleanor read the day she died. (Aside from the Danson fandom, Garfinkel says he was only recognized as Doug Forcett once, by someone working on another show with him. Place a Legal Notice Phil was one of the Bad Place demons who chose not to work with Michael in the newly established system of torture for humans. At least it offered answers to someone named Neil, who actually asked about snail first aid because he was worried about ending up in the Bad Place for stepping on snails. Terms of Use I studied math and neurobiology on the east coast before moving out here in 1987 for grad school in computer science. Ultimately, the 6 together as a unit are each others soul mates or it may be even include Trevor or a few others going forward. To what extent is our morality natural to us and to what extent is it the result of up-bringing? Other incompatibilistscalled libertarianshold that determinism is false; we have free will. This updated analysis indicates that the average carbon footprint of (streaming) a half-hour Netflix show is equivalent to driving around 200 metres in a conventional car. Forcett is the Worst Person this week not just because hes a human guilt trip, or because of the crimes he committed against Rosa Parks the deer tick, Franklin Delano Raccoon, Abraham Lincoln Einstein Mandela Goose, and Martin Luther Gandhi Tyler Moorenot to mention the inhumane-sounding decision to keep 71 dogs and wolves inside the same penbut also because his good deeds are entirely self-serving. We know Eleanor is reading the Libra entry because she mocks the tip given in that paragraph: "Live every day like it's your last" (an ironic piece of writing given that she's about to enter the afterlife). And Eleanor confronts Donna Shellstrop, the mother she believed dead, but who had simply faked her own death and started a new life in Nevada. The demons were celebrating a heist by drinking Snake Juice, which was featured on season three of "Parks and Recreation. He found his Doug in writer and comedian Noah Garfinkel, who worked with Schur's wife, J.J. Philbin, onNew Girland was friendly with other members of theGood Placeteam. Doug, a stoner from Calgary, is well-known in the show's universe for his "92 percent correct" understanding of the afterlife. Here's my issue with this: Doug admits to Janet and Michael that the only reason he does what he does is to get points. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. In his book Moral Tribes, Harvard University professor of psychology Joshua David Greene argues that being a happiness pump might create more societal harm than good. Pam Grier reflects on her most iconic roles, from Coffy to Jackie Brown. Asked what made Garfinkel the perfect Doug, Schur issues twofold reasoning. News For more behind-the-scenes stories and details from this NBC series, listen to the 50+ episodes of "The Good Place: The Podcast" here (or wherever you get your podcasts). "The Good Place" is a creative and detailed comedy series beloved by fans. He initially had the portrait, too, but gave it to Garfinkel as part of a Secret Santa gift exchange on another show he worked on, Single Parents. [chuckle] Privacy Policy As a companion, Doug isnt ideal, given that his whole lifestyle doubles as an implicit critique of the carbon footprints, unethical clothing, and gluttonous diets of anyone who opts not to live like him. Inspired by Eleanors suggestion of taking the Soul Squad to the next level, Michael skips straight to the highest level imaginable: meeting afterlife icon Doug Forcett, whose portrait once adorned Michaels office wall in the Bad Place. ), and he's simplistic or "Ya Basic!". The magic panda later briefly appears as an Easter egg on season two, episode eight ("Leap to Faith") at the 12-minute, 16-second mark. It wasn't in portrait form this time, but Doug Forcett as his younger self, now in the Good Place and going all in on the buffet table at Jason's goodbye party. When Michel and Janet visit Doug Forcett to learn how to live the best possible life, the life they see is not a good life. Why isn't Mindy St Claire asking Janet to conjure up some cocaine? For viewers, that idea is a thread of hope that sustains us through the devastating season 3 finale, when Chidi decides that their only chance at succeeding in their new Good Place neighborhood experiment is if he gets rebooted, losing all memory of his most recent and meaningful romantic relationship with Eleanor. Forcett (Michael McKean), whos famous among immortals for correctly intuiting the Good-Bad Place points system while high on magic mushrooms in October 1972, lives like a hermit (and a little like Chuck McGill, with a side of Desmond Hume and James Delos) in the Alberta wilderness, so Michael and Janet drop by his house posing as reporters from the Calgary Times Examiner who want to talk to him for a human-interest piece. He helps as a hedge against damnation. The Calgary teen got stoned in the '70s and made a near-perfect prediction of how the afterlife worked, which earned him celebrity status (and a very well-placed portrait) in the world of the. He comes back on later seasons when the protagonists encounter the Bad Place demons again. By clicking Sign up, you agree to receive marketing emails from Insider Though the doctrine of double effect fuels that episode-specific plotline, it also subtly advances the story of Eleanor and Chidis relationship by prompting Eleanor to show Chidi the video footage from an earlier reboot in which they confess their love to each other. Doug Forcett shouldn't have any points at all because he's only motivated by his own reward, right? For self-centered Eleanor, the idea that the answer might be related to our relationships with other people is more than a little mind-blowing. Circulation & Delivery, About Us But some philosophers, such as David Hume, are soft-determinists who hold the compatibilist position that determinism is true and yet we are free. Doug Forcett, a character in Netflix's The Good Place Doug Forcett, played by Michael McKean, is, to put it bluntly, a bit of a mess. 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